Foley is Pod - Dude Love Goes Bad [Show Notes] (Patreon)

We are officially at the point - 25 years ago Mick - where you got involved in something that would lead to some of the biggest moments of your career.

We covered in the archives at FoleyonYouTube.com your run with Terry Funk as Cactus & Chainsaw coming out of WrestleMania and the very brief tag team title run you had.

You wrote in your book that the plan was to transition to you & Marc Mero after WrestleMania and that you had come up with a good idea for the program between the two of you.

Do you remember the idea?

Marc had changed his style after his knee injury and was getting over with his gimmick of attempting to control his then wife Sable - what was different about working with Marc now compared to previous years when you had turned down a WrestleMania match with him?

Had your relationship with him changed as you ascended in the company and he declined in it?

Was the plan for Sable to go with you?

Do you know what character you would’ve portrayed in the program with Marc?

You wrote in your book that you received a surprise phone call from Vince Russo that changed your outlook on the business.

How far in advance of WrestleMania did you know that you would be working with Steve?

I ask because as we covered coming out of WrestleMania the next night Terry can’t wrestle and you’re in the ring for DX being reformed as a super group in a cage where you lost the tag team title match to the New Age Outlaws. So if the plan was to turn you heel and work with Steve there was no long-term program coming out of that night right?

Did you talk to Terry about the plans? What did he think of them?

Were you excited to be a heel working with Steve on top?

When Russo told you that it was Steve’s idea - what do you attribute that to?

You seem to be the choice of a lot of people to work with while they’re on top - do you take a sense of pride in that?

You would write in your book that you would need a reason - motivation - off of what Michael Hayes had told you earlier in your career. For those that don’t know what that means - can you explain it to us?

Was there any consideration as to what character you would be playing? Did you have a preference or something you thought would match up best with Steve?

The night after WrestleMania is when the inspiration hits you…from your book:

“DX left the ring, and several fans started to leave, thinking the show was over.

In an attempt to keep them in their seats, Howard Finkel’s voice cut through the Albany, New York, air. “Ladies and gentlemen, remember, coming up soon will be ... Stone Cold Steve Austin.” The place went wild and started chanting his name. “Austin, Austin, Austin,” came the noise as I slowly got to my feet. I looked at Terry and the very real pain that was etched on his face. I thought of myself, and the years of painful mornings I’d had to endure.

Two of the hardest-working SOBs in the history of

the business, and all we were to Albany was sprigs of parsley on a plate. Well, I may have been a sprig, but I was a sprig with feelings, and they’d just been hurt. That was definitely a negative. There was also a positive. I had a reason, and it was a good one.”

When you walk through the curtain after that show - do you go up to Vince McMahon or Vince Russo or anybody and go…I got what I needed to be a top heel.

How is that explained to the Vinces? Do you tell them - I need 15 minutes tomorrow on Raw to cut a promo and it’ll start my heel turn?

The next night is in Syracuse and it’s a TV taping and you go out there in a neck brace and cut this amazing promo…

***If you could get Mick to read this I think it would be amazing but I understand if you don’t***

Raw airing 4/6/98:

“I have always taken a lot of chances in the ring, and some very bad things have happened to me over the years. What I’ve always had is the comfort of knowing that when I looked at my career, my dreams, the things I’d accomplished and the things I’d set my heart on, that it was always worth the pain. So people ask, ‘Cactus, how’s your neck?’ I’d say that I’ll be damned if I’m gonna let a group of scum like DX put Cactus Jack away.

“Oh, I guess you see that Terry Funk’s not here, and I haven’t talked to Terry, but I left a message on his answering machine, and I’m not saying this to sound tough, but Cactus Jack and Terry Funk do not miss wrestling matches. So I have to guess if the Funker was hurt enough to fly home, than it’s probably pretty bad.

“I really wish that people could know Terry a little bit more than just what they see in the ring, because people will always debate on who the greatest wrestler of all time is, but I guarantee you, you ask every damn last bunch of people in the dressing room, they’ll say that Terry Funk is the gutsiest old bastard they’ve ever seen in their lives. Now, I guess you’ve probably seen Terry’s back and I hope you saw WrestleMania, because it was a tremendous match, and I’m very proud of it. And Terry was lying there on the bed with his belt and he said, ‘Cactus, it’s all been worth it. But we don’t have those belts now, do we?’

“And I’m not gonna get into the reason why, but I will say that when Cactus Jack was lying there, and I was conscious, and I could barely move, it was very hard to move, and I was not very far from being unconscious. And when I looked at Terry Funk, I heard something in my ears and, to tell you the truth, it kind of made me sick.

“That’s ... there was an announcement being made thanking the fans for coming to the World Wrestling Federation, and they said something about Stone Cold Steve Austin, and people started chanting his name. And it’s funny, because when I came here two years ago I was Mankind, and there were always people saying, ‘Why don’t you just be Cactus Jack?’ Then I came out in tie-dye and some white boots and they said, ‘Why don’t you just be Cactus Jack?’

“Well, I gave you Cactus Jack. I gave you every goddamn bit of energy I had, and when I was lying there helpless, you chanted someone else’s name. This is not a knock on Stone Cold Steve Austin; hey, I’m happy he’s the champion, and he may not admit it, but we’ve known each other a long time and he’s been my friend; but what you did to me and Terry Funk laying there in the middle of the ring was not only distasteful and disrespectful, it was disgusting.

“Well, I can finally say for the first time after thirteen years of blood, sweat, and tears that it’s not worth it anymore. It’s gonna be a long time before you see Cactus Jack in the ring again.”

It’s emotional - it’s real - it’s everything that you would want to accomplish without making it seem so obvious you’re going to be working with Steve Austin. Is this the perfect promo?

How are you feeling afterwards?

What do you & Steve talk about as a program - or did you two leave it to creative?

There’s a week in between the promo airing and the European tour so you still go to Europe and wrestle as Cactus Jack including this match from a Europe only pay-per-view Mayhem in Manchester:

Goldust (w/ Luna) pinned Cactus Jack when, as Cactus attempted a suplex into the ring, Luna swept Cactus’ leg out from underneath him and held it down during the cover; after the bout, Sable attacked Luna, with Marc Mero appearing and holding her back; moments later, after Goldust and Luna left ringside, Sable shoved Mero to the mat and left the ring alone.

Talk about being a sprig Mick…

The rest of the European tour would see Kane & Goldust defeat you in Obenhausen & Berlin before you would team with Ken Shamrock to defeat the Rock & D’Lo in Bayreuth before it ends in Hamburg with Goldust defeating you as the promo airs on Raw…any memories of this European tour?

Are you taking it easy knowing you’re working on top with Austin at the next pay-per-view?

I ask that because Mick…YOU WORK A FUCKING INDIE DATE!

That’s right…you fly home from a WWF european tour - two days before Raw finally defeats Nitro and ends the 83 week streak…and you’re in Milwaukee for Great Lake Championship Wrestling at the Eagle’s Club Presidental Ballroom and defeat Col. Corruption to win their title! How did you have clearance to do this? How does this even happen? Did you require Col. Corruption to do the JOB for you since you’re working on top with Stone Cold?

It just tickled me to see that in my research…

April 13th, 1998 - the date that the 83 week streak ends and it’s the return of Dude Love. This is one of - and even Dave Meltzer called it the best TV episode in the company’s history up until this point - best stories ever told on a single episode of Raw is War.

It begins with Austin challenging Vince and it’s built up where Vince agrees after everyone tells him it’s a terrible idea, you got Gerald Brisco in the back showing Vince how to counter the kick before the stunner, Shane McMahon’s first appearance on TV as Shane McMahon, it’s just groundbreaking stuff.

You’re sitting in the back watching it all - did you know or have the feeling that tonight - this is the night?

Is it special to have all this happen in Philadelphia where so many moments of your career took place?

Well the main event comes and Vince puts the breaks on it - Steve Austin said during the night he could defeat Vince with one arm tied behind his back so he makes Steve do it - and then out of nowhere - Dude Love’s music hits and here you come strutting and juking and jiving down the ramp…

Any nerves backstage?

You knew breaking up Vince - Austin - the way it was built - was going to be a tremendous amount of heel heat right?

But why Dude Love do you think?

Dude’s promo - again it would be great to have him read it -

“The Dude wants to know, can’t we all just get along? I got to level with ya, Philadelphia. The Dude does not feel a whole lot of love out here tonight.

“But, Steve-O, as you know, there’s only one cat who can bring peace to the Warzone, and that’s Dude Love. Now, Stone Cold, I know you got your heart set on putting some heavy-duty booty to Uncle Vinny, but the Dude has got to put the veto on this one. Oh, we are tight, Steve-O, about as tight as two cats can be. But you got to understand, Steve- O, Vince McMahon writes the checks that let the Dude live the kind of life that the Dude likes to live. So I guess you could say, Uncle Vinny, you are my main man.

“And I want you to remember one thing and remember it good. When you look at Stone Cold Steve Austin, you’ve got your eyes set on the world’s toughest SOB, and he can put you down on your A double S just like ... “

Vince shoves you down on your ass - and when it looks like you’re going to get your hands on Vince - you turn around and lock the mandible claw in on Austin and the show goes off the air never having Vince vs. Steve but with you having the WWF champion on his back with the mandible claw - just great great stuff.

You walk through that curtain - is everyone going - this is what’s going to end the streak?

When do you find out that it did?

From the Torch

That streak ended on Apr. 13 as Raw drew a 4.6 average compared to Nitro’s 4.3. The WWF had shown signs of momentum in the ratings the last two weeks. Expectations were that both WCW and the WWF would go full-out to win this past Monday. Instead, the WWF put forth one of its best programs ever (in terms of storylines and interviews, but certainly not quality of wrestling) while WCW presented a Nitro that, outside of the final segment, resembled a flat edition of TBS Thunder.

You’re at Raw taping the next day when the rating comes out - do you remember it being any different?

Do you take any pride in being involved in the last segment that ended the 83 week streak?

Was it special for you considering the issues you had with WCW in the past?

You wrote this in your book:

“Dude was even given his own “Love Shack” interview segment, which featured a pink shag rug, love beads, lava lamps, and new Dudettes. The Dudettes seemed to be a different breed now. Gone was the innocence of old-replaced by the skimpiest of thong bikinis. Under those guidelines, my wife gracefully declined the company’s invitation to resume her role from the previous summer”

Were you…happy with the change of direction of Dude?

What was in your mind that you needed to change to get Dude to top heel status from the previous happy midcarder?

Was it a style direction - or did you plan on doing all that with promos?

The next Raw opens with Vince McMahon fining you $5,000 for what happened at the end of Raw - not quite leaning into you being his new guy in charge of ridding the WWF Title off of Steve Austin - but as the show would progress it certainly would be obvious.

You’re in the main event that night with Steve Blackman - a barn burner anywhere Mick - and Vince McMahon coming to ringside to do commentary.

As your ***** classic is going on - JR asks Vince point blank how Dude was qualified to be the number one contender and Vince didn’t really have an answer for him. This level of storytelling is just tremendous Mick - and it builds to a crescendo…

JR also points out that Earl Hebner was out of the hospital and would be available to referee at Unforgiven - and Vince points out that Earl would be his ideal choice to be the referee of the match and that Vince planned at being ringside for the match - the only match he would’ve been at ringside for since Survivor Series 1997.

This level of story - after the issues you had with what Vince did to Bret at that show - what did you think about it?

When did you know that Vince was really going to be the lead heel for this program and was it obvious to you?

The end of the match would see you lock Steve Blackman in an abdominal stretch - and Vince at ringside would ring the bell immediately - an exact copy of the Survivor Series finish with Bret & Shawn - and you celebrate your victory while Blackman claims he never submitted and goes after the timekeeper and the referee.

From the Torch

Austin, catching on that McMahon was showing him what he could do to him at Unforgiven, stormed to the ring. He, as promised earlier in the show, shoved McMahon and threw him to the ground. Dude attacked Austin, but Austin gave him the Stunner in the ring. McMahon then fled the scene. Jim Ross closed the show by asking, “Is Vince McMahon going to screw Dude Love out of the title this Sunday on pay-per-view?”

Even though Austin defending against Dude Love doesn’t create instant images of box office hysteria, the storyline that McMahon will be at ringside and has promised a “catastrophic” occurrence might tempt fans to order the event to see if McMahon — this time as part of a storyline — flexes his promoter’s muscles, so to speak, and screws Austin out of the title “just like he did to Bret Hart.” Ironically, the same week McMahon, for storyline purposes, admitted to screwing Bret, simultaneously on Nitro, Bret was screwing Randy Savage out of the WCW Title, helping Hogan get the pin and regain the belt.

Mick - did you feel the story was right when everything with Bret was still Raw?

Did you have any qualms about it?

Did you ever talk to Bret about it?

Did you think this was the right story to tell for Austin’s first big pay-per-view title defense?

Nitro does beat Raw that night but it doesn’t really matter at this point does it? Once you end the streak - that’s all that’s important right?

You do not work any house shows between that Raw and Unforgiven in Greensboro. Was that something the office wanted to make sure you were good to go or something you wanted?

Before we get to the match and and all that - with the pay-per-view taking place in Greensboro - there’s a lot of controversy at the time with Ric Flair and his status in WCW and with the show being in Greensboro there was a lot of rumor & innuendo that Flair would show up and sit in the crowd. Did you remember hearing anything about that and would you had welcomed the Nature Boy at this time into the WWF if it happened?

Also on the show - you had to follow an Inferno match - that’s right a ring surrounded by fire for the Undertaker & Kane’s match…was that going to be something that was difficult to follow do you think?

Let’s get to it Mick! Unforgiven 1998 - Steve Austin’s first WWF title defense against Dude Love…

From your book:

“The Pay-Per-View match was a tremendous success, both artistically and financially. I actually had a great deal of doubt leading up to this match as I wasn’t quite sure how to keep the Dude in character while at the same time making him seem like a threat to the Federation champion. I even

dyed my hair a little to try to alter the Dude’s persona. I later found out that even the office had reservations about this matchup.”

What were your reservations about it?

Do you know what the office’s reservations were?

The lack of top heels in the company at the time didn’t make it seem like the company was setting Steve up for success and out of necessity it had to put Vince in that role…is that fair to say?

From the Torch

“Steve Austin came out to a huge pop. He grabbed the timekeeper/bell ringer Mark Eaton at ringside and dragged him into the ring. He asked Eaton if McMahon told him when to ring the bell on Raw last week. Eaton looked believably nervous and said he rang it when he was supposed to. Austin told him if McMahon screws him out of the title, after he finishes beating McMahon up and down the aisle, he would beat him up. He said Eaton had a choice — choose between his job and his life.”

Were you surprised they had Austin come out early and have that huge pop saved for a segment with Mark Eaton - or do you think it built to the match later on?

“Vince McMahon came out, accompanied by Pat Patterson and Jerry Brisco. McMahon began by saying: “Something catastrophic is going to happen here tonight. That could mean anything.” I guess he was covering his guarantee by expanding the definition of “catastrophic.” McMahon told the crowd his mother had the pleasure of giving birth to him in Pinehurst, N.C., so he said to the Greensboro fans, “It’s kind of nice to be back home.” He said it would be “beneath his dignity” to respond to accusations that he is going to screw Steve Austin out of the WWF Title. He said he would accept no responsibility if “Stone Cold screws Stone Cold,” a take off of the post-Survivor Series interview he gave. Ross quipped sarcastically: “Yeah, time honored tradition or something.”

Having an interview segment on a pay-per-view - not something that was happening often but it really helped your story here did it not?

How good is JR to be able to build off of this and really set the tone for it?

“7) Dude Love beat Steve Austin via DQ at 18:40 when Austin hit Vince McMahon with a chair. As the match began, Ross said he couldn’t believe a wrestling executive once said Austin would never make it wearing just black tights. “What a dummy,” Ross concluded.”

We just loved taking shots at WCW and Eric Bischoff at this time didn’t we? Do you think the company was fed up and finally able to fire back when the ratings streak was broken?

“At 3:10 Austin and Dude brawled onto the music stage. Austin threw Dude off the stage and Dude took a huge bump to the floor. Devastating looking, but he got up.”

Mick - this bump is tremendous and really overlooked in your career - but it’s one of the biggest goddamn ones wasn’t it?

“At 7:30 Dude held Austin in a full body chinlock at which point Vince McMahon walked to the ring, accompanied by Jerry Brisco and Pat Patterson. McMahon looked at bell ringer Mark Eaton and smiled. Eaton looked back nervously. Austin noticed McMahon sitting at ringside and leaned over the top rope to yell at him. Dude rolled up Austin from behind for a believable near fall. The kick out came at two, so it was unrealistic for Eaton to even pretend it was a three count. McMahon, though, leaped up during the roll-up two count, excited at the possibility of Dude’s pinfall.”

Such an underrated spot - did Patterson help put this match together with you & Steve?

“At 11:30 McMahon walked over to Austin who was laid out on the floor in the aisleway. He taunted him verbally. Austin began backing McMahon toward the locker room, which gave Dude a chance to nail Austin from behind. McMahon gloated.”

All the little bits here with Steve and Vince are really adding to the match and not taking away from it - do you think you were overshadowed though in the match?

“At 13:40 Dude applied an abdominal stretch, the same finish that led to the early bell ring during the Dude vs. Blackman match on Raw the previous week. McMahon signaled for Eaton to ring the bell as if Austin gave up (a la Shawn Michaels had the sharpshooter on Bret Hart). However, Austin quickly reversed the abdominal stretch, which caused McMahon to frantically wave off his order. The bell didn’t ring, much to McMahon’s relief. At ringside Austin suplexed Dude onto the ringside stairs in a bump that rivaled his bump off of the stage earlier.”

This level of storytelling is just great Mick - the boss trying to screw Austin - you trying not to mess it up - this isn’t that easy of a match to put together and you guys did it really flawlessly - but you’re taking an insane amount of punishment as well aren’t you?

“Dude tried to run from Austin, jumping over the railing. Austin chased after him and threw him back over the railing to the ringside area. Back in the ring Dude took over and at 16:00 he signaled for Sweet Chin Music. Austin blocked it and went for a quick Stunner. Dude, though, clotheslined the ref when Austin ducked.”

I mean - you know you’re building to another match next month right so you can’t do everything here - but you needed that ref bump didn’t you?

“Austin pummeled Dude with punches. Dude, though, blocked Austin’s stunner attempt and applied his Mandible Claw. McMahon could barely control his excitement at ringside. Austin, though, punched his way out of the claw. Dude gave Austin a low-blow and reapplied the claw. McMahon tried to revive the referee, slapping him to get his attention. The ref remained knocked out. Dude went for a third Mandible claw, but Austin backdropped Dude over the top rope to the floor. McMahon picked up a chair, but Austin wrested it from him. Austin hit Dude. Dude got the chair and charged Austin, but Austin lifted his elbow and knocked the chair into Dude’s face. Then he hit Dude with the chair. As McMahon tried to help Dude to his feet, Austin swung a chair ostensibly at Dude, but clearly at McMahon, knocking him out cold. McMahon didn’t blink, twitch, or move for the rest of the event. Austin gave Dude the Stunner in the ring and covered him, but the ref was still knocked out. Austin counted to three on his own, the fans popped, Austin’s music began to play, he grabbed his belt, and he walked to the back holding it in the air. Meanwhile, paramedics tended to McMahon putting on his “Long Island Neck Brace.”

Just a great match - great story - everything.

Something that Wade pointed out and I wanted to bring up - just a few days before - Buff Bagwell had been hurt badly in a match with Rick Steiner on Thunder that really people thought he was paralyzed in the ring. Any consideration to anything changing or its just one of those things that happen?

“Austin is pretty much back to the level he was before his injury and Dude took some awesome bumps that fit into the context of the storyline of the match. The finish also fit well into the ongoing Austin-McMahon soap opera without hurting Mick Foley, who apparently will be getting rematches against Austin. (***3/4)”

Everyone has to be excited after how well this was executed and came off right?

From your book:

“As it turned out, all our fears were quickly relieved, and Austin and I tore the house down. Vince was simply hilarious in his role as the crooked boss who was looking for any opportunity to screw the “Rattlesnake” out of the gold. His facial expressions, with the exception of the bobbing Adam’s apple during times of fear, are the best in the business.

At the end of the match, Dude was down and out, as the concerned McMahon tried in vain to lift his 300 pounds off the ground. Austin wielded a chair, which was supposedly meant for Dude, but strayed by about two feet and caught the evil Vince square in the head. Vince went down, to the delight of the fans, but the bell was rung immediately, signaling the disqualification of the champion. Dude had won! Dude had won! In the words of Owen Hart, “I did it! Yes! I am a winner! Woo!” Unfortunately, the belt cannot change hands on a DQ, so Austin remained the champ.”

306,000 buys for this show - obviously down from the 809,000 of WrestleMania - but it is the biggest In Your House of all time - continuing your streak of being Mr. In Your House

Was this one of your biggest paydays in your career at this point?

How excited for you to continue this story?

Well we’ll continue the story next month when we discuss Over the Edge and your rematch - but in the next few weeks we have some great episodes coming your way.

Next week - we’ll discuss Lockdown 2009 when you defeated Sting to win the TNA Title and wrote a book about it - in two weeks we’ll discuss your friend, the late great Owen Hart, then we’ll open the show up to the fans for Ask Mick Anything and then Cactus Gets Extreme!

But Mick - today is the day for the Huntsville Comic Con to begin isn’t it?

Friday, Sat & Sunday you’ll be at the Von Braun Center - get all the info at hsvexpo.com.

Next week you’ll be in McAllen, Texas for the South Texas Comic Con as well - be sure to check them out at southtexascomiccon.com!

And can we officially announce it? A&E’s Most Wanted Treasures?